DrCheckRaise - FeltStars Poker Forum

RNGs. Read this posting I found on card shuffling. It's well written and I think clearer than a lot I've seen. (1 reply)

aaron52 — Thu, 26 Aug 2010 04:15:19 -0700

while do one of my random searchs on google for RNG and poker related things (every so ofton do ramdom googling on things i like to keep up on to see if anything new is out there and this also sometimes returnes things prior searches didn't fine..this works as a way to keep me grounded and return my thinking about poker online back to an objective position) i came accross this well writen post on RNGs and some of it's potentional flaws when applied to online poker.. I think anyone interested in the subject might find worth reading..additionaly anyone who has found most articals a little tuff to absorb because they tend to go from ienglish to super tech. langauge mid sentence......might want to give it a glance .....i found it to have very little of that while still getting all the need info to the reader.....so check it if your interested in RNGs....

September 28, 1999

By Brad Arkin, Frank Hill, Scott Marks, Matt Schmid, Thomas John Walls, and Gary McGraw Reliable Software Technologies Software Security Group

Poker is a card game that many people around the world enjoy. Poker is played at kitchen tables, in casinos, and cardrooms — and more recently, the Web. A few of us here at Reliable Software Technologies play poker. Since many of us spend a good amount of our days online, it was only a matter of time before some of us put the two interests together. This is the story of how our interest in online poker and software security mixed to create a spectacular security exploit. The PlanetPoker Internet cardroom offers real-time Texas Hold’em games against other people on the Web for real money. Being software professionals who help companies deliver secure, reliable, and robust software, we were curious about the software behind the online game. How did it work? Was it fair? An examination of the FAQs at PlanetPoker, including the shuffling algorithm (which was ironically published to help demonstrate the game’s integrity) was enough to start our analysis wheels rolling. As soon as we saw the shuffling algorithm, we began to suspect there might be a problem. A little investigation proved that this intuition was correct.

The Game

In Texas Hold’em, each player is dealt two cards (called the pocket cards). The initial deal is followed by a round of betting. After the first round, all remaining cards are dealt face up and shared by all players. The dealer places three cards face up on the board (called the flop). A second round of betting then takes place. Texas Hold’em is usually a fixed limit game, meaning that there are fixed amounts that a player may bet in each betting round. For example, in a $3 to $6 game, the first two betting rounds are $3 bets while the third and fourth betting rounds are $6 bets. After the second round of betting, the dealer places another card face up on the board (called the turn). A third round of betting then takes place. Finally, the dealer places the last card face up on the board (called the river), and a final round of betting ensues. Each remaining player takes their two pocket cards and combines them with the five community cards to make the best five-card poker hand. The best hand among the players is determined by standard poker hand order.Texas Hold’em is a fast-paced and exciting game. Bluffing is an essential part of the game, and quick decisions about who is holding what sorts of cards separate winners from losers. Interestingly, Texas Hold’em is the poker game played at the World Series of Poker which is held annually in Las Vegas.Now that everybody and their dog is online, and virtually all types of businesses are represented on the Internet, it’s only natural that casinos and cardrooms are there too. Even with the reasonably easy availability of casinos on Indian reservations and riverboats, there is still real demand for more accessible games. Being able to play online in the comfort of your own home (not to mention in your pajamas), without having to endure second-hand smoke and obnoxious players, is definitely appealing.

Security Risks Abound

All this convenience comes at a price. Unfortunately, there are real risks to playing poker online. The casino may be a fraud, existing only to take money from naïve players without ever intending to pay back winnings. The server running the online casino could be cracked by a malicious attacker looking for credit card numbers, or trying to leverage some advantage in the game. Since a majority of casinos don’t authenticate or encrypt the network traffic between the player running the client program and the server hosting the card game, a malicious player could conceivably examine the network traffic (with a classic person-in-the-middle attack) for the purposes of determining his opponent’s cards. These risks are all very familiar to Internet security experts.Collusion is a problem that is unique to poker (as opposed to other games like blackjack or craps), since poker players play against each other and not the casino itself. Collusion occurs when two or more players seated at the same table work together as a team, often using the same bankroll. Colluding players know what their team members’ hands are (often through subtle signals), and bet with the purpose of maximizing their team’s profits on any given hand. Though collusion is a problem in real cardrooms, it is a much more serious problem for online poker. Using tools like instant messaging and telephone conference calls makes collusion a serious risk to online poker players. What if all the players in an online game are all cooperating to bilk an unsuspecting Web patsy? How can you be assured that you’re never a victim of this attack?Last, but not least (especially in terms of our story), there is a real risk that the software behind an online poker game may be flawed. Software problems are a notorious form of security risk often overlooked by companies obsessed with firewalls and cryptography. The problem is that a software application can introduce truck-sized security holes into a system. We spend a great deal of time in our day jobs finding and solving software security problems. It is only natural that we turned our attention to online poker. The rest of this article is devoted to a discussion of software security problems we found in a popular online poker game.

Software Security Risks

Shuffling a Virtual Deck of Cards The first software flaw we’ll focus on involves shuffling virtual cards. What does it mean to shuffle a deck of cards fairly? Essentially, every possible combination of cards should have an equal likelihood of appearing. We’ll call each such ordering of the 52 cards a shuffle.In a real deck of cards, there are 52! (approximately 2^226) possible unique shuffles. When a computer shuffles a virtual deck of cards, it selects one of these possible combinations. There are many algorithms that can be used to shuffle a deck of cards, some of which are better than others (and some of which are just plain wrong).

We found that the algorithm used by ASF Software, Inc., the company that produces the software used by most of the online poker games, suffered from many flaws. ASF has changed their algorithm since we contacted them regarding our discovery. We have not looked at their new approach. Getting everything exactly right from a security perspective is not easy (as the rest of this article will show).

Figure 1: The Flawed ASF Shuffling Algorithm

procedure TDeck.Shuffle;
var
ctr: Byte;
tmp: Byte;

random_number: Byte;
begin
{ Fill the deck with unique cards }
for ctr := 1 to 52 do
Card[ctr] := ctr;

{ Generate a new seed based on the system clock }
randomize;

{ Randomly rearrange each card }
for ctr := 1 to 52 do begin
random_number := random(51)+1;
tmp := card[random_number];
card[random_number] := card[ctr];
card[ctr] := tmp;
end;

CurrentCard := 1;
JustShuffled := True;
end;

The shuffling algorithm shown in Figure 1 was posted by ASF Software in order to convince people that their computer-generated shuffles were entirely fair. Ironically, it had the exact opposite effect on us.

The algorithm starts by initializing an array with values in order from 1 to 52, representing the 52 possible cards. Then, the program initializes a pseudo-random number generator using the system clock with a call to Randomize(). The actual shuffle is performed by swapping every position in the array, in turn, with a randomly chosen position. The position to swap with is chosen by calls to the pseudo-random number generator.

Problem One: An Off-By-One Error

Astute programmers will have noticed that the algorithm in question contains an off-by-one error. The algorithm is supposed to traverse the initial deck while swapping each card with any other card. Unlike most Pascal functions, the function Random(n) actually returns a number between 0 and n-1 instead of a number between 1 and n. The algorithm uses the following snippet of code to choose which card to swap with the current card: . The formula sets random_number to a value between 1 and 51. In short, the algorithm in question never chooses to swap the current card with the last card. When ctr finally reaches the last card, 52, that card is swapped with any other card except itself. That means this shuffling algorithm never allows the 52nd card to end up in the 52nd place. This is an obvious, but easily correctable, violation of fairness.

Problem Two: Bad Distribution Of Shuffles A closer examination of the shuffling algorithm reveals that, regardless of the off-by-one problem, it doesn’t return an even distribution of decks. The basic algorithm at the heart of the shuffle is shown in Figure 2.

Shuffling

A closer examination of the algorithm reveals that, regardless of the off-by-one error, it doesn’t return an even distribution of shuffles. That is, some shuffles are more likely to be produced than others are. This uneven distribution can be leveraged into an advantage if a tipped-off player is willing to sit at the table long enough.

To illustrate this problem using a small example, we’ll shuffle a deck consisting of only three cards (i.e, n=3) using the algorithm described above.

Figure 2: How not to shuffle cards

for (i is 1 to n)
Swap i with random position between 1 and n

Figure 2 contains the algorithm we used to shuffle our deck of three cards, and also depicts the tree of all possible decks using this shuffling algorithm. If our random number source is a good one, then each leaf on the tree in Figure 2 has an equal probability of being produced.

Given even this small example, you can see that the algorithm does not produce shuffles with equal probability. It will produce the decks 231, 213, and 132 more often than the decks 312, 321, 123. If you were betting on the first card and you knew about these probabilities, you would know that card 2 is more likely to appear than any other card. The uneven probabilities become increasingly exaggerated as the number of cards in the deck increase. When a full deck of 52 cards is shuffled using the algorithm listed above (n=52), the unequal distribution of decks skews the probabilities of certain hands and changes the betting odds. Experienced poker players (who play the odds as a normal course of business) can take advantage of the skewed probabilities.

Figure 3: How to shuffle cards

for (i is 1 to 3)
Swap i with random position between i and 3

Figure 3 provides a much better shuffling algorithm. The crucial difference between the two algorithms is that number of possible swap positions decreases as you progress through the deck. Once again, we show a tree illustrating this algorithm on our sample deck of three cards. The change between this new algorithm and the one used by ASF is that each card i is swapped with a card from the range [i, n], not [1, n]. This reduces the number of leaves from the 3^3 = 27 given by the bad algorithm listed above to 3! = 6. The change is important because the n! number of unique leaves means that the new shuffling algorithm generates each possible deck only once. Notice that each possible shuffle is produced once and only once so that each deck has an equal probability of occurring. Now that’s fair!

Generating Random Numbers on a Deterministic Machine

The first set of software flaws we discussed merely changes the probabilities that certain cards will come up. The associated skews can be used by a clever gambler to gain an edge, but the flaws really don’t constitute a complete break in the system. By contrast, the third flaw, which we explain in this section, is a doozy that allows online poker to be completely compromised. A short tutorial on pseudo-random number generators sets the stage for the rest of our story.

How Pseudo-Random Number Generators Work

Suppose we want to generate a random number between 1 and 52, where every number has an equal probability of appearing. Ideally, we would generate a value on the range from 0 to 1 where every value will occur with equal probability, regardless of the previous value, then multiply that value by 52. Note that there are an infinite number of values between 0 and 1. Also note that computers do not offer infinite precision!

In order to program a computer to do something like the algorithm presented above, a pseudo-random number generator typically produces an integer on the range from 0 to N and returns that number divided by N. The resulting number is always between 0 and 1. Subsequent calls to the generator take the integer result from the first run and pass it through a function to produce a new integer between 0 and N, then return the new integer divided by N. This means the number of unique values returned by any pseudo-random number generator is limited by number of integers between 0 and N. In most common random number generators, N is 2^32 (approximately 4 billion) which is the largest value that will fit into a 32-bit number. Put another way, there are at most 4 billion possible values produced by this sort of number generator. To tip our hand a bit, this 4 billion number is not all that large.

A number known as the seed is provided to a pseudo-random generator as an initial integer to pass through the function. The seed is used to get the ball rolling. Notice that there is nothing unpredictable about the output of a pseudo-random generator. Each value returned by a pseudo-random number generator is completely determined by the previous value it returned (and ultimately, the seed that started it all). If we know the integer used to compute any one value then we know every subsequent value returned from the generator.

The pseudo-random number generator distributed with Borland compilers makes a good example and is reproduced in Figure 4. If we know that the current value of RandSeed is 12345, then the next integer produced will be 1655067934 and the value returned will be 20. The same thing happens every time (which should not be surprising to anyone since computers are completely deterministic).

Figure 4: Borland’s implementation of Random()

long long RandSeed = #### ;

unsigned long Random(long max)
{
long long x ;
double i ;
unsigned long final ;
x = 0xffffffff;
x += 1 ;

RandSeed *= ((long long)134775813);
RandSeed += 1 ;
RandSeed = RandSeed % x ;
i = ((double)RandSeed) / (double)0xffffffff ;
final = (long) (max * i) ;

return (unsigned long)final;
}

Based on historical precedent, seeds for number generators are usually produced based on the system clock. The idea is to use some aspect of system time as the seed. This implies if you can figure out what time a generator is seeded, you will know every value produced by the generator (including what order numbers will appear in). The upshot of all this is that there is nothing unpredictable about pseudo-random numbers. Needless to say, this fact has a profound impact on shuffling algorithms!

On To Poker, Or How To Use A Random Number Generator Badly

The shuffling algorithm used in the ASF software always starts with an ordered deck of cards, and then generates a sequence of random numbers used to re-order the deck. Recall that in a real deck of cards, there are 52! (approximately 2^226) possible unique shuffles. Also recall that the seed for a 32-bit random number generator must be a 32-bit number, meaning that there are just over 4 billion possible seeds. Since the deck is reinitialized and the generator re-seeded before each shuffle, only 4 billion possible shuffles can result from this algorithm. Four billion possible shuffles is alarmingly less than 52!.

To make matters worse, the algorithm of Figure 1 chooses the seed for the random number generator using the Pascal function Randomize(). This particular Randomize() function chooses a seed based on the number of milliseconds since midnight. There are a mere 86,400,000 milliseconds in a day. Since this number was being used as the seed for the random number generator, the number of possible decks now reduces to 86,400,000. Eight-six million is alarmingly less than four billion. But that’s not all. It gets worse.

Breaking the System

The system clock seed gave us an idea that reduced the number of possible shuffles even further. By synchronizing our program with the system clock on the server generating the pseudo-random number, we are able to reduce the number of possible combinations down to a number on the order of 200,000 possibilities. After that move, the system is ours, since searching through this tiny set of shuffles is trivial and can be done on a PC in real time.

The RST exploit itself requires five cards from the deck to be known. Based on the five known cards, our program searches through the few hundred thousand possible shuffles and deduces which one is a perfect match. In the case of Texas Hold’em poker, this means our program takes as input the two cards that the cheating player is dealt, plus the first three community cards that are dealt face up (the flop). These five cards are known after the first of four rounds of betting and are enough for us to determine (in real time, during play) the exact shuffle. Figure 5 shows the GUI we slapped on our exploit. The “Site Parameters” box in the upper left is used to synchronize the clocks. The “Game Parameters” box in the upper right is used to enter the five cards and initiate the search. Figure 5 is a screen shot taken after all cards have been determined by our program. We know who holds what cards, what the rest of the flop looks, and who is going to win in advance.

Figure 5: The GUI for our exploit

Once it knows the five cards, our program generates shuffles until it discovers the shuffle that contains the five cards in the proper order. Since the Randomize() function is based on the server’s system time, it is not very difficult to guess a starting seed with a reasonable degree of accuracy. (The closer you get, the fewer possible shuffles you have to look through.) Here’s the kicker though; after finding a correct seed once, it is possible to synchronize our exploit program with the server to within a few seconds. This post facto synchronization allows our program to determine the seed being used by the random number generator, and to identify the shuffle being used during all future games in less than one second!

Technical detail aside, our exploit garnered spectacular press coverage. The coverage emphasizes the human side of our discovery. See our Web site for our original press release, the CNN video clip, and a New York Times story .

Doing Things Properly, or How to Shuffle Virtual Cards

As we have shown, shuffling virtual cards isn’t as easy as it may appear at first blush. The best way to go about creating a shuffling algorithm is to develop a technique that can securely produce a well-shuffled deck of cards by relying on sound mathematics. Furthermore, we believe that publishing a good algorithm and opening it up to real-world scrutiny is a good idea (which meshes nicely with the opinions of the Open Source zealots). The main thing here is not relying on security by obscurity. Publishing a bad algorithm (like AFS did) is a bad idea, but so is not publishing a bad algorithm!

Cryptography relies on solid mathematics, not obscurity, to develop strong algorithms used to protect individual, government, and commercial secrets. We think shuffling is similar. We can stretch the analogy to include a parallel between cryptographic key length (which is directly proportional to the strength of many cryptographic algorithms) and the size of the random seed that is used to produce a shuffled deck of cards.

Developing a card-shuffling algorithm is a fairly straightforward task. The first thing to realize is that an algorithm capable of producing each of the 52! shuffles is not really required. The reasoning underlying this claim is that only an infinitesimally small percent of the 52! shuffles will ever be used during play. It is important, however, that the shuffles the algorithm produces maintain an even distribution of cards. A good distribution ensures that each position in the shuffle has an approximately equal chance of holding any one particular card. The distribution requirement is relatively easy to achieve and verify. The following pseudo-code gives a simple card-shuffling algorithm that, when paired with the right random number generator, produces decks of cards with an even distribution.

START WITH FRESH DECK
GET RANDOM SEED
FOR CT = 1, WHILE CT <= 52, DO
X = RANDOM NUMBER BETWEEN CT AND 52 INCLUSIVE
SWAP DECK[CT] WITH DECK[X]

Key to the success of our algorithm is the choice of a random number generator (RNG). The RNG has a direct impact on whether the algorithm above will successfully produce decks of even distribution as well as whether these decks will be useful for secure online card play. To begin with, the RNG itself must produce an even distribution of random numbers. Pseudo-random number generators (PRNG), such as those based on the Lehmer algorithm, have been shown to possess this mathematical property. It is therefore sufficient to use a good PRNG to produce “random” numbers for card shuffling.

As we have seen, choice of initial seed for the PRNG is a make or break proposition. Everything boils down to the seed. It’s absolutely essential that players using a deck of cards generated using a PRNG can’t determine the seed used to produce that particular shuffle.

A brute force attempt to determine the seed used to produce a particular shuffle can be made by systematically going through each of the possible seeds, producing the associated shuffle, and comparing the result against the deck you’re searching for. To avoid susceptibility to this kind of attack, the number of possible seeds needs to be large enough that it is computationally infeasible to perform an exhaustive search within certain time constraints. Note that on average only half of the seed space will need to be searched until a match is found. For the purposes of an online card game, the time constraint would be the length of that game, which is usually on the order of minutes.

In our experience, a simple program running on a Pentium 400 computer is able to examine approximately 2 million seeds per minute. At this rate, this single machine could exhaustively search a 32-bit seed space (2^32 possible seeds) in a little over a day. Although that time period is certainly beyond the time constraints we have imposed on ourselves, it is certainly not infeasible to use a network of computers to perform a distributed search within our real time bounds.

The subject of brute force attacks serves to emphasize the aptness of our analogy between key length in a cryptographic algorithm and the seed behind shuffling. A brute-force cryptographic attack involves attempting every possible key in order to decrypt a secret message. Likewise a brute-force attack against a shuffling algorithm involves examining every possible seed. A significant body of research studying the necessary lengths of cryptographic keys already exists. Generally speaking, things look like this:
Algorithm Weak Key Typical Key Strong Key
DES 40 or 56 56 Triple-DES
RC4 60 80 128
RSA 512 768 or 1024 2048
ECC 125 170 230

People used to think that cracking 56-bit DES in real time would take too long to be feasible, but history has shown otherwise. In January 1997, a secret DES key was recovered in 96 days. Later efforts broke keys in 41 days, then 56 hours, and, in January 1999, in 22 hours and 15 minutes. The leap forward in cracking ability doesn’t bode well for small key lengths or small sets of seeds!

People have even gone so far as to invent special machines to crack cryptographic algorithms. In 1998, the EFF created a special-purpose machine to crack DES messages. The purpose of the machine was to emphasize just how vulnerable DES (a popular, government-sanction algorithm) really is. (For more on the DES cracker, see [www.eff.org].) The ease of “breaking” DES is directly related to the length of its key. Special machines to uncover RNG seeds are not outside the realm of possibility.

We believe that a 32-bit seed space is not sufficient to resist a determined brute-force attack. On the other hand, a 64-bit seed should be resistant to almost any brute force attack. A 64-bit seed makes sense since many computers provide the ability to work with 64-bit integers off the shelf, and a 64-bit number should be sufficient for the purposes of protecting card shuffling against brute-force attacks.

64-bits alone won’t do it though. We can’t overemphasize that there must be absolutely no way for an attacker to predict or approximate the seed that is used by the PRNG. If there is a way to predict the seed, then the computationally-taxing brute-force attack outlined above becomes irrelevant (since the entire system breaks much more easily). In terms of our exploit, not only did ASF’s flawed approach rely on a too-small 32-bit PRNG, but the approach relies on a seed based on the time of day as well. As our exploit demonstrated, there is very little randomness in such an approach.

In final analysis, the security of the entire system relies on picking a random seed in a non-predictable manner. The best techniques for choosing such a random number are hardware-based. Hardware-based approaches rely on unpredictably random data gathered directly from the physical environment. Since online poker and other games involving real money are extremely security critical undertakings, it’s probably worth investing the necessary resources to ensure that random number generation is done correctly.

In concert, a good shuffling algorithm and a 64-bit pseudo-random number generator seeded with a proven hardware device should produce shuffles that are both fair and secure. Implementing a fair system is not overly difficult. Online poker players should demand it.

[www.tips4poker.com]

Note: I have edited out some non-related material, added a direct link to the article, and corrected some grammer in the title─Axman

Winner at Feltstars (1 reply)

NoFkinWay — Tue, 24 Aug 2010 09:17:25 -0700

Ok - is this the bragspot???

Just took down the 1K Guaranteed 22 Rebuy at Feltstars for $504. Yippee!!!

It was sort of an accident - I don't normally play $20 torunaments, but thought I would give it a shot. After I registered, I realized it was a rebuy, so now I was way over my limit for entry fees. I didn't get a hand for the first 40 minutes and the table was very aggressive. Busted with big draw vs pp, and decided I would allow myself one rebuy. Doubled up just before the rebuy was over. At that point I had about 20 BBs, soI decided the extra $20 for the add-on was not gonna help much, so skipped it. . Played really patient, never sucked out, and took it down for my biggest win in a few years.

No matter how successful or a player (no replies)

henderson — Fri, 20 Aug 2010 23:47:45 -0700

No matter how successful or a player, sooner or later he loses. The main thing for the challenging case of loss - losing as little as possible. And someone can stay on the black strip, and not afford to continue to play with losses to the purse. Someone loses everything to the last penny.

When the unlucky player to have something to lose, and he does not want to stop it float away millions in cash casinos, but the player himself is another legendary figure, losing in the ashes of a vast fortune. How, for example, Terrence Watanabe, a millionaire, one year left on Black Jack more than 125 million dollars.

He filed a lawsuit against one of the largest casinos in Las Vegas - Caesar's Palace ", which had spent all this time. According to Watanabe, casino employees pumped his free spirits, and a step would not leave him, not letting him recover. With such treatment, said Terrence Watanabe, he became a beggar. But the casino did not stay in debt, putting the unfortunate American counter-claim for all his IOU.

Stories about millionaires, completely ruined the game for the casino quite numerous. But officials involved in such stories - a rare phenomenon. One of the brightest stars in the sky shone with excitement once Betty Loren-Maltes, the mayor of a small American town.

This lady has lost 12 million dollars from government coffers. A lady took gambling money, committing fraud with insurance documents and nedoplachivaya taxes. As a result, she was sentenced to eight years in prison, and now she has a chance to recover from his gambling addiction.

Among the famous players, losing millions in casinos, there are Russian Prima Donna. Several years ago, Alla unsuccessfully to stay at the casino in Baden-Baden, and its budget is relieved a million dollars. But it is not slackened its desire to gamble. For a long time diva was facing one of Moscow casinos, and thus could not play for their money, but in fact due to the casino. Apparently, she is addicted to the game, and completely forgot what it means to really play.

The largest loss can be ranked and the 15 millionth Australian magnate Kerry losing Packer. He lost the money in a casino in one sitting ", making a big bet, but he gave them just as easily, quite upset. No wonder - despite the failure of the Packer is a real lucky, because his legendary standing wins $ 20 million are known to all casinos in the world, and when Mr Packer decided to visit one of their casinos, his owners are preparing to advance staggering losses.

DrCheckRaise Cashes In 50K (no replies)

DrCheckRaise — Mon, 16 Aug 2010 11:28:42 -0700

I enjoy the 50k event at FeltStars. This last Sunday I cashed for $750.00 in that event and it was a quality game. Hope others will join me in the coming weeks.

Feltstar's Casino Leaderboard is Broken (2 replies)

Corey — Tue, 24 Aug 2010 08:37:59 -0700

I'm going to try to get into the feltstars $250 Casino Leaderboard freeroll.. But check this out

#46 builtbybob 135.96
#47 razzmatazz33 110.65
48 mgj3560 12.5
49 rafa10vip 101
50 cjc1972 100

How in the **** is a guy with 12.5 points in position #48 then the guy in #49 with 101 points?

This is not the first time I've seen the sort order totally mucked up

It makes FeltStars look like a totally amateurish operation!

Feltstars Anniversary? (1 reply)

RocketmAAn — Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:52:06 -0700

Is FeltStars coming up on a 1 year launch anniversary in Sept or October?

Any Events in the works?

NoPayPoker FeltStars Friday (no replies)

Axman — Wed, 11 Aug 2010 09:31:00 -0700

Updates 8/11/10:

The NoPayPoker FeltStars Friday event has been changed from 3:00 pm ET to 6:00 pm ET.
This event is under the Tournaments-Private tab at 17:00 in the FeltStars lobby.
DCR Forum members should be able to play in these games. See Events Calendar for more details.

Events Calendar─New Games and Passwords Added (13 replies)

Axman — Mon, 23 Aug 2010 21:28:47 -0700

The DCR Events Calendar, located right above the Announcements, has been updated, including new games and passwords.

CHECK IT OUT NOW

♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ B)

FeltStars Player Wins $94,000.00 In One Hand (6 replies)

DrCheckRaise — Thu, 19 Aug 2010 16:08:17 -0700

FetlStars player MARIA236 won $94,166.48 in one hand. Yep she hit the bad beat when her Straight Flush was beaten by a higher straight flush.. Now that is a welcomed bad beat. What a pay out !

FeltStars Pro Tyler Smith Wins World Poker Open (1 reply)

DrCheckRaise — Mon, 09 Aug 2010 12:54:42 -0700

FeltStars Pro, Tyler Smith won the World Poker Open on July 31st cashing for over $152,000.00. The World Poker Open was held at the Gold Strike Casino in Tunica, Mississippi and marks Tyler's 3rd outright win, bringing his tournament winning to over three quarters of a million in his young career.

It was just in April when Tyler won the Spring Break Poker Classic cashing for more than $111,000.00 in that event. It is becoming obvious that we are going to hear alot from this young star in the future.

You can play poker with Tyler at FeltStars. FeltStars is the fastest growing poker site on the Merge Network. His screen name is "Tyler Smith" at FeltStars and he is often a bounty in the FeltStars Bounty games.

We had the pleasure to interview Tyler on the PokerJoe and The Doc Podcast which can be found on the right side of this page. That interview was made the day he was making the final table at a WPT event in Biloxi. Click and Listen to the interview or mark him as a friend when you are in the FeltStars Game Client. Or take him out in the FeltStars Bounty Game.

HUD for Feltstars? (6 replies)

NoFkinWay — Tue, 24 Aug 2010 13:01:44 -0700

Anyone know which HUD's work at Feltstars?

Replayer for Feltstars? (no replies)

NoFkinWay — Fri, 06 Aug 2010 21:19:29 -0700

Does anyone know of a tournament replayer that is compatible with Feltstars hand histories? I am a member at PXF and can't get their replayer to work with my Feltstars histories.

$1,000.00 FreeRoll At FeltStars (Get Your PassWord NOW) (5 replies)

DrCheckRaise — Sat, 07 Aug 2010 23:23:42 -0700

Sunday Aug 8th at 13:00 server time (2 pm ET), there will be a $1,000.00 Freeroll at FeltStars.

This freeroll is by invitation to Affiliates. Since DrCheckRaise Poker Forums is the Largest FeltStars affiliate, that means that we should bring home the most cheese from this event.

If you do not have a FeltStars account, get yours now, by clicking on the FeltStars banner at the top of this page..... yep.. the one with my pretty face on it.... Use Bonus Code DRCHECK300 in case you ever make a deposit, then you will get a 300% deposit bonus.

Now I plan on waiting until Sunday to post the password for this event. Or you can e-mail me at admin@drcheckraise.com and I will immediately reply with the password.

DrCheckRaise Members Cash in the 50k at FeltStars (10 replies)

DrCheckRaise — Thu, 05 Aug 2010 19:20:09 -0700

Looks like some of our members had some success at the 50k on FeltSTars today. I see that MasterDan Cashed for a couple of grand. Jason FeltStars Lipscomb cashed as well.

The biggest bread winner from here though was DeadGuyFelt, known as DeadGuy2 here at DCR. He took second place for $6,500.00

Great Job everyone... keep up the good work and if I missed anyone, let me know...

Hate to tell bad beat stories, but I was doing well in the 50k until I got KK and I raised preflop. Someone re-raised me and I moved all in. I was relieved when he turned over 88.. SWEET, my JOY was short lived when the 8 fell on the river.... I loved his call, but hated him hitting....

Private Cash Game (28 replies)

DrCheckRaise — Sat, 21 Aug 2010 18:05:55 -0700

Poll: What days of the week would be best for you to play in a cash game online?

Several of us play in regular cash games live and it is always a good time getting together with the same cast of characters and playing some cards. So I thought it might be fun to set a time every week when we have a private cash game online. A game where regulars can get together at the same time and same place a few times a week. It will be a private table that only our members will be permitted in.

What I need from you is some feedback as to the days of the week that would work for you and at what levels you would like to play for... Again.. these will not be tournaments, but cash games. It will be a great way to learn from one another as well.

Please post here as well to let me know at what levels you want to play... for example...

1/2 no limit $50 min Buy-in $300 Max Buy-in

Or any other variation... just let me know what kinda game you want to play... you can do that publicly here or privately by clicking on PM and sending me that information.....

PJD league status (2 replies)

racingstud43 — Tue, 03 Aug 2010 15:48:13 -0700

Do we even have a league anymore? We have several loyal players but haven't seen an update on Pokerjoeandthedoc. com in over a month. We are losing players and several games have been cancelled due to lack of players. There have been no payouts and no one knows where they are in the points. We want this league to continue and look forward to the return of Joe and Ken, but there might be anything left of the league before they get back.

sitting out status (no replies)

aaron52 — Sun, 11 Jul 2010 18:57:21 -0700

if you are playing in a live tourn. and you look around at the table you can see in a second if anyone is sitting out and with out spending any of your gray matter to determine it..being able to do so and know if players are sitting out is an important thing to know.......at FS you to jump thru hoops to stay on top of hat should be a no brain er.....why haven.t they add a sitting out notice at the players seat when they are sitting?????? i keep waiting and thought that they would have fixed that by now ...normally i never bitch or say anything that's not on the positive side....but I'm making an exception on this one just this once...sorry bout that lol....but it would be much appreciated if they fixed that........

Leaderboard Promotions (no replies)

FeltStars — Wed, 07 Jul 2010 10:54:34 -0700

Please take a look at our new leaderboard promotions. Also within the next two weeks we will have some big news about our site.

Also, we are going to have our Bounty tournament on the third Sunday of each month. Our team pro's have been in Las Vegas for the WSOP, and Doc has been on the Poor Mans Poker Tour, so this will get most everyone back. We will also be doing a welcome tournament for Danielle "HotAusChick2" Adams-Benham and she is going to have a special tournament that will have some great give aways.

Track some of our players in the main event this year. Tyler Smith had a great day 1 and John Dolan has had a great world series so far with winning close to $100,000 and made it through day 1 also with a healthy stack.

If you ever have any questions you can always P.M. and I will get back to you as soon as I can

finally another big win at Feltstars (1 reply)

tablecapn1 — Sun, 27 Jun 2010 03:56:55 -0700

Finally won the 6k guaranteed tourney tonight for $2,464.00.. been trying to hit that 1 for a while now and finally made it to the end. I had to rebuy twice and added on as well so i had over 200 invested but it worked out this time. Also got 2cnd in a 1k this afternoon for $200 so i had a pretty good day..

ELAYNEFLACK

Misinformation (2 replies)

DrCheckRaise — Thu, 17 Jun 2010 08:49:18 -0700

Please allow me to put this to rest.. I hope.... As a Journaist, I respect the privacy of those who supply me information..... So I have not put the names of owners out there who wanted to protect their privacy..... I have gotten permission form the owner of FeltStars to put this to rest because there was so much bad information being put out there.

Let me make this clear. The only thing they have in common is that I asked FeltStars to allow people to transfer money from PPC a few months before they closed, but FeltStars does this with a few other sites as well so that really has no bearing. Everyone knows I am a pro over at FeltStars so I know who is involved. Let me tell you Feltstars is owned by Richard Gutherson whom is based in the UK. In which I also dealt with the people at PPC, whom was owned entirely by US business people, based in the US. With FeltStars this is owned by a European with absolutely no interest or involvement with PPC. I hope this can put this to rest.

Money depostied on FeltStars is not only Garunteed by FeltStars and it's owners, but also by Merge. FeltStars is the fastest growing Skin on the Merge network. The sky is not falling, and I ask you to not post damaging information that is not confirmed.. because it is incorrect...... I understand concerns, but concerns from misinformation is "The sky is falling mentality" and only hurts the wrong people.

I have further information posted in the new PPC section that lets people know that an arbitration date has been set for unpaid winnings form PPC.

Great News on Danielle "HAC", Lacy Jones and intro for Jeff Burnett (4 replies)

jontm — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 17:32:53 -0700

Hello all, been awhile but things are getting bigger and badder for many original members of DCR. Behind the scenes Doc and I are able to touch base here and there but as you know, things are happening fast these days! Many of our members countinue to grow on both sides of the felts. Our network is solid throughout the world and continues to grow!

First off, many of you know Danielle "HAC" Adams-Benham. There might be a thread here already but huge congrats to her on being signed as a new Feltstars pro! She looks great (as always) on the cover of Australian Poker Weekly! I also had an opportunity to have some of Danielle's writing published in Canadian Poker Player Magazine. Her article, "There is Something About Mary" can be viewed at video: [[video]www.canadianpokertour.tv[] (the pdf of the actual article with creative is in the news feed somewhere) and we wish her success with her new Poker Pod Cast, "WTF Poker" as well as her own www.womenspokernews.com site. On top of all that, our own "Hot Auusie Chick has had the blog of the month for several consecutive months at www.pokerweblogs.com. I have asked her to visit and bring you all up to speed as there is so much to tell!

In another story, it doesn't matter if you are part of the USA or in Canada, you probably are a fan of Miss Lacey Jones.
Many poker news sites were left wondering what was next for her after the announcement was made that she was leaving the Absolute Poker/Ultimate Bet team. What many of you may or may not know is that Lacey also became the spokesperson and face of the Canadian Poker Tour early this year. So it comes with great pride that I bring you the news that she is now part of the Full Tilt Team! Lacey has been a joy to have on our team, friendly to everyone she meets on our felts and a great friend. Way to go girl! Lacey has commentated for practically every tour and large event in North America, including the WSOP, WPT, BCPC'c and our own CPT, and has been on countless poker television programs. Here is a link to a great short video highlighting some:

I was able to find 5 different magazine covers that she has graced just in my collection. Again, all well deserved!

There will be a gentleman stopping by that goes by Jeff "the acetenbomber" Burnett. Jeff does a ton to try to build poker here up north in Canada and has a video that he is trying to win a contest on Victory Poker. (Men, it centers around a hot tub scene so you might want to check it out). Mr. Burnett was one of the head table man recently on Full Tilt's televised Canada Cup of Poker. It would be great to see him take this down as hey, we like him and the Victory Pros are very close to many people within our network, so to have one of our own on their team would be great! I want you all to know the purpose of this post is not promote any site, rather the players. Got to:

and click on the image in the top row with the group of ladies in the hot tub to view. Being the strong community that DCR is, I thought you might all enjoy the news!

(PS. The magazine in the video with Antonio on the cover, I wrote the article and interviewed him :) :) )

Check Recieved Quickly (17 replies)

AceHighBluff — Tue, 17 Aug 2010 06:03:17 -0700

I just wanted to post that I just cashed out some $ on FeltStars. I requested the cashout May 25th, and was pleasantly surprised to recieve the check today, June 5th. I should also note that the check was cashed with no problems at all. This was also a historic event for me as this was the first time I have ever cashed money OUT of a real money site! Great work on the speedy payment FeltStars.

Hello (10 replies)

FeltStars — Sun, 22 Aug 2010 07:55:53 -0700

I will be here every chance I can to answer any question that you may have. I will also give any updates and promotions that will be up and coming. Please let me know if there is anything I can do. We wish you good cards at the tables.

Jill
Jill@Feltstars.com
FeltStars.com

100k final (no replies)

vincolletti — Thu, 20 May 2010 20:51:24 -0700

I qualified for the 100k final . Didn't realize could qualify through 500 vip point. Used my last 500 points lost with qq to k10 king on river came back from 250 $s to get ticket. Only 25 people with 15 makiing it through. Won't have to play in the May 30th semifinal , I see a couple of people from forum have also gotten their ticket, see you there good luck.

Rookie Move, Lesson Learned, Don't Let This Happen To You (1 reply)

Catfish63 — Wed, 19 May 2010 23:50:53 -0700

I was playing in the 2X Tuesday Event yesterday. I had not been hitting and decided that it would be better for me to possibly take my chip stack below 3000 prior to the first break in order to set up both a re-buy and an add-on. The tournament timer listed 2 minutes until break. I posted a bet that would take me to 2999 if I lost. My bet was re-raised and I folded. (26o) I immediately re-bought and a message appeared stating that the re-buy would be paid at hand conclusion. My single opponent Rabbit hunted showing QQ. (The board showed I would have beat him with a straight to my 6...sheesh) As soon as the screen cleared, the break message appeared stating the break will soon begin. Another message appeared asking if I wished to purchase the add-on. At this point my re-buy still had not been credited to my stack! I answered yes to the add-on and it was immediately credited. At that time, I thought that it was the re-buy posting and was waiting for the break to conclude so that I would have my full stack of 8999 chips.
...never happened.
Apparently, the software credits the add-on before anything prior and this put me over the minimum required to re-buy. I contacted on-line support. Long story even longer is that they cannot credit chips during a tournament. They took incredibly detailed accounting of the event to forward to MERGE. They also gave me a 2.20 satellite entry ticket. I don't know if the $2.00 re-buy was credited back to my account as it is such a small amount I didn't notice.
I sent Poker Joe a note about this event and he has been very helpful. Bottom line...we play with a fantastic group of people and we also play at a great on-line poker room.
Don't process re-buys when the tourney clock states 2 minutes remain.

V/R
Catfish63

CASHIERS for everyone. (no replies)

RocketmAAn — Fri, 14 May 2010 15:43:56 -0700

I gave up trying to reconcile my account. I was attempting to determine what I was going to be paid for the $25 free bet promo. I wasn't sure if the $25 had been deducted from my account already and there also was a Deposit listed for what appeared to be the wrong amount. I had to contact support.

I had made a (now one-way) deposit from eWalletXpress (eWX) for XX. My "real money ledger" was showing a "Deposit" for XX+25. After the eWX site came back up, I confirmed it wasn't for that amount. Knowing that free money would eventually catch up to me I contacted support (actually there is a clause about getting paid in error in the Sportsbook T&C, nullifying any subsequent wagering gains until error is reported. I'm not planning on wagering, but thought I would mention it). My balances in my own spreadsheet seem to be either right or off by 25, but I found any activity for the Casino hard to trace. In the end it turns out,

THERE ARE * 3 * CASHIERS or 2 cashiers, 1 with 2 interpretations.

There is the Cashier accessed from the Poker Lobby / game client.

There is cashier info on the Player Admin web page (accessed from the game client via the button at the bottom). However, I'm not counting this as a cashier even though it is 1 of only 2 places to get transaction information.

On the FeltStars web page there is a Cashier link at the top and the bottom of the page. They go to 2 different places.

The top brings up a cashier that shows balances, allows transfers, and lists wagers.
The link on the bottom of the page takes you to the FeltStars Cashier. This is the one you want for complete info. This one can also be accessed from the "Deposit" link on the previous "top-of-page" cashier link or from the poker lobby Cashier by clicking on "Deposit".

Choose "Account Statement" and you will see all money transfers. (for poker buyins/entries, you'll have to slog through the real money ledger mentioned above if your spreadsheet is missing something). This is the only place you will see incoming money, ie a real Deposit. Under Deposits I found the correct amount coming from eWX. The other "Deposit" was really a transfer from the Casino and in this cashier shows as "SellChips" under the Casino and "BuyChips" for the matching entry under the Merge Poker Account. One small not: the way the Support person was reading off my transactions indicated that most/all transfers go through the Cashier Account on their way to it's destination, but it's transparent to you. You could transfer to Cashier account, then transfer to Poker account if you wanted to do it that way.

There was only a "SellChips" entry for a player to player transfer and I think the history only goes back to Feb/March since the original player transfer to me isn't shown.
The Bonus/Free money amount for a Real Money Deposit shows as "BuyCoupon"

Why you can't see real deposits and withdrawals in the other Cashiers is beyond me. I think it's all from a combination of site upgrades and mergers that the information seems uncoordinated.

Why can't they get the times right? (12 replies)

Zzulran — Wed, 12 May 2010 11:27:11 -0700

Why is the lobby always a hour off is their a way to fix that so annoying. They can have me run naked thru the woods but can't get the clock to be on time? Also is there a way to view the game lobby from the game?

Freeroll Password (no replies)

DrCheckRaise — Sat, 01 May 2010 10:38:10 -0700

If you are looking for the freeroll password it it is posted at the top in announcements. If you cannot see announcements at the top then you are not logged in. Members can log in and see it, those who are not members cannot see it. If you are not a member it is easy to become a member.

FeltMoney (4 replies)

TBJM35 — Thu, 13 May 2010 11:41:53 -0700

Trying to deposit using this, and no one is contacting me back. Is this still a way to deposit? Has anyone used this?
I swear my money is good. LOL!! I know doc is busy so i tried another pro, and still nothing. I tried the credit card thing, and customer service told me it was down. Help i want to play.

WSOP Main Event Seat Coupon (no replies)

DrCheckRaise — Tue, 27 Apr 2010 06:16:01 -0700

Get your 2010 WSOP Main Event Seat at FeltStars. Anyone who makes a $25 deposit or more will get a coupon to play in this game. Presently there are less than 300 [players in this event. One of us whould win this.