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What is a bad beat? Or do we beat ourselves?

What is a bad beat? Or do we beat ourselves?
avatar Subject :  What is a bad beat? Or do we beat ourselves?
Date:       April 15, 2009 02:30AM
Before even looking at the hand, look at the stacks. I tried to write this post the same as I ws thinking out the hand then. Too bad it was Level one thinking and all I truely saw was my hand. Looking at this "terrible" beat now with all the info....

You can see one player is a clear chip leader. He is aggresive and fairly loose. Also on the big blind.

Do you think he will allow a bunch of limpers being last to act?

Its early and he has about half the chips in play. I expect he will open the door with a steal and even if he does have a hand, I know I'm not behind. As expected He raises and thins the field. Perfect!

I should have a tight image, I haven't played much. I double his raise. I don't want a race, I want to trap and play it street by street, but hey if he shoves..... I'll call without a second thought.

The flop is kinda scary, but the odds of me being already beat are fairly slim. I have position too. He checks. I don't know where I am at, I can bet and play the next street. The wrong turn card could mean I'm drawing dead, so I don't want to check behind and give him a walk.

I'd hate to fold this. But I can't make it cheap...oh no! A pot sized bet commits me....a value bet gives odds with two players in. I should push....ya just push...they have to fold right?

Why check if your just gonna call? They are folding and its a fat pot for this early. Besides I'm Good, how can I not be?

I'm all in!! One folds....YES! The big stack is taking his time....ya just posturing..its mine. Oh.... he calls, well more chips for me!!!

Shit! he does have outs...just have to dodge em with only two to come. FUCK!!! He turns it...No set for me...no paired board to counterfit....fuck, fuck, fuck...the river doesn't matter I am drawing dead with......

2 outs to a set and 1/3 of his chips once the flop hit. The board could have counterfited on the turn and put me way ahead...if it was the right suit and doesn't give him trips or a second pair...so its a coin flip he can afford to make. Into a juicy pot and oh shit thats right he is LAG.

But thats still a bullshit call! Isn't it???...

provided he believes I have a hand...I didn't raise in early position then I min raise his raise....maybe a resteal type play? Maybe I have a medium pockets and he has overs to add to his outs which are looking pretty damn good based on this line of thought. He might have as many as 20 outs here he is getting the right odds even with my shove!

Here it is.... the famous bad beat (Only in my own eyes at that moment)....Enjoy!


PokerStars Game #26764867755: Tournament #153600256, $1.00+$0.20 Hold'em No Limit - Level III (25/50) - 2009/04/05 18:02:41 ETTable '153600256 1' 9-max

Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: HansKrause (1550 in chips)
Seat 6: Chokolada (1410 in chips)
Seat 7: RonD83 (6500 in chips)
Seat 8: jon-tm1 (1990 in chips)
Seat 9: luciami (2050 in chips)

Chokolada: posts small blind 25
RonD83: posts big blind 50
*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to jon-tm1 [Ah Ac]
jon-tm1: calls 50
luciami: calls 50
HansKrause: calls 50
Chokolada: folds
RonD83: raises 150 to 200
jon-tm1: raises 200 to 400
luciami: calls 350
HansKrause: folds
RonD83: calls 200*** FLOP *** [Kd 8d Qd]
RonD83: checks
jon-tm1: bets 1590 and is all-in
luciami: folds RonD83: calls 1590
*** TURN *** [Kd 8d Qd] [7d
]*** RIVER *** [Kd 8d Qd 7d] [4h]

*** SHOW DOWN ***RonD83: shows [Jd As] (a flush, King high)
jon-tm1: shows [Ah Ac] (a pair of Aces)

RonD83 collected 4455 from pot

*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 4455

| Rake 0 Board [Kd 8d Qd 7d 4h]Seat 1: HansKrause (button) folded before FlopSeat 6: Chokolada (small blind) folded before FlopSeat 7: RonD83 (big blind) showed [Jd As] and won (4455) with a flush, King highSeat 8:

jon-tm1 showed [Ah Ac] and lost with a pair of Aces

Seat 9: luciami folded on the Flop




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/15/2009 06:16AM by jontm.
Re: What is a bad beat? Or do we beat ourselves?
avatar Subject :  Re: What is a bad beat? Or do we beat ourselves?
Date:       April 16, 2009 11:06PM
I have the same problem. Overplaying big pairs. Making big bets or big calls when it's not necessary. A lot of times it's out of sheer laziness. I figure if I win it will be a huge pot and I'll have a big lead, and if I lose i can just start a new game. There is no need to go broke just because you have an over pair early in a tournament. But I sometimes just lack the discipline to do the right thing. Especially if you've been 'card dead'.

It's like I said in my own clinic. The risk of giving the free card can sometimes be outweighed by the risk of going bust. You can't always just factor in pot odds. In Jon's example, if the cards had been played face up, there is no amount he could bet that would make his opponent fold. Why put yourself in a position to get bad beated; to get unlucky? Winners create situations that allow them to get lucky and avoid getting unlucky.

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